Episode Description - How to Transform Your Marriage in One Weekend
What if one weekend could deliver the clarity and progress of months of traditional marriage counseling? In this podcast episode, licensed clinical counselor Ann Cerny reveals a revolutionary approach to couples therapy that combines cutting-edge brain science with personalized intensive sessions that can transform your marriage, no matter how far gone you think it is.
Her weekend retreats go far beyond typical weekly therapy sessions, offering hope for marriages on the brink of separation through a carefully curated experience that addresses the deepest patterns keeping couples stuck.
During her intensive weekend format, Ann guides couples through transformational exercises that teach them how to truly listen and speak while managing their own reactive patterns at the same time.
For couples considering whether their relationship is salvageable, Anne offers a powerful reframe: the question isn't whether your marriage is fixable, but rather how committed you are to doing the work and examining your own contribution to the dynamic.
If you and your spouse are struggling to keep your marriage together, and traditional marriage counseling isn’t working for you, this episode just might change your marriage … and your life.
Show Notes
About Ann
Ann is a licensed clinical counselor in both Illinois and California. She specializes in couples therapy for people who are interested in changing their dynamics today, and need it to stick. For couples who are ready for deep and lasting change, Ann's couples intensives are a personalized experience for one couple at a time, in Sausalito and Palm Desert, California. It is ideal for couples who are in crisis or considering separation, are healing from betrayal or emotional distance, want to rebuild trust and intimacy, or need focused time but can't commit to weekly therapy. One dedicated weekend can deliver the clarity and progress of months of therapy, because the relationship gets curated time and attention it needs and deserves.
Connect with Ann
You can connect with Ann on LinkedIn at Ann Cerney and follow Ann on Instagram at Cerney Coaching. To find out more about Ann’s work visit her website at Cerney Coaching.
Key Takeaways From This Episode with Ann
- Ann Cerney is a licensed clinical counselor in IL & CA, specializing in couples therapy and intensives.
- Her own divorce inspired her focus on helping couples in crisis or on the brink of separation.
- Couples intensives involve pre-work, two focused days, and follow-up, often equal to months of therapy.
- The process combines personalized exercises, psychoeducation, and the “initiator-inquirer” (eye-to-eye) method.
- Based on the developmental model of couples therapy: couples evolve through stages, often stuck at differentiation.
- True change requires building capacity. Real breakthroughs happen when partners build the ability to listen, respect, and stay grounded.
- Attachment styles and unresolved trauma shape relationship dynamics, but growth and healing remain possible.
- Success depends on both partners’ willingness to self-reflect, not just blame each other.
- Discernment counseling supports a structured path for “mixed-agenda” couples—one leaning in, one leaning out—to decide their next step.
- Relationships must keep growing; intensives provide hope, clarity, and momentum for change.
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Transcript
How to Transform Your Marriage in One Weekend
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
discernment, communication, counseling
SPEAKERS
Karen Covy, Ann Cerney
Karen Covy Host
00:10
Hello and welcome to Off the Fence, a podcast where we deconstruct difficult decision-making so we can discover what keeps us stuck and, more importantly, how we can get unstuck and start making even tough decisions with confidence. I'm your host, Karen Covy, a former divorce lawyer, mediator and arbitrator, turned coach, author and entrepreneur. And now, without further ado, let's get on with the show.
With me today I have the pleasure of speaking with Ann Cerney, and Ann is a licensed clinical counselor in both Illinois and California. She specializes in couples therapy for people who are interested in changing their dynamics today and need it to stick, For couples who are ready for deep and lasting change Ann's couples intensives are a personalized experience for one couple at a time, and they're in Sausalito and Palm Desert, California. They're ideal for couples who are in crisis or considering separation, are healing from betrayal or emotional distance, want to rebuild trust and intimacy, or need focused time but can't commit to weekly therapy. One dedicated weekend can deliver the clarity and progress of months of therapy, because the relationship gets the curated time and attention it needs and deserves. Ann, welcome to the show.
Ann Cerney Guest
Thank you, Karen, Glad to be here.
Karen Covy Host
I'm thrilled to have you here and I want to dive into your couples intensives, because I love this idea. But before we do that, can you tell the listeners about how you got from where you started as just a regular therapist to where you are now?
Ann Cerney Guest
01:54
Oh yeah, absolutely yeah. In my own life I went through, you know, I've been married, I have three children and unfortunately my marriage was not able to last and we did seek couples therapy a couple of times. But we also were expats for a number of years in Singapore and I think that was sort of the crowning blow to an already really hard relationship and since then I have just really been drawn to divorce and couples and wanting to help people. The longer I'm working with couples, the more I realize that it is possible for many people who are on the brink of ending their relationship to fix it and to make it a good, sustainable relationship. So that's kind of my story in a nutshell is really going through the hardship of divorce and raising three kids who are all fine, but it was tough and it's the gift that keeps giving.
Karen Covy Host
03:04
Yeah, yeah, I can totally relate to that and you know, you and I have known each other for years and years because we met while you were still in Illinois and practicing in Illinois, and I know how dedicated you are and were and are to helping people who are either going through a divorce or on the brink of divorce, and I love this idea of an intensive weekend. But if you can tell me a little bit about that weekend and how is that different from just going to weekly therapy?
Ann Cerney Guest
03:35
Yeah, that's a great question because I think a lot of people think of it that way. But a couple's intensive is first of all a lot of thought goes into it for the couple. Before they get there there's quite a bit of pre-work that they're working on and I ask them to spend at least an hour on every questionnaire and that gets them thinking. And then when I receive the information, it gives me the opportunity to sort of curate two days for them that are more tailored to their specific needs. And so there are some sections of the weekend that are more delving into the past and looking at what they've shared in their questionnaires and pulling that together with them and sort of giving them a picture, of helping them see a picture of where they are today and how they got here and looking for strengths, and so that's a couple of hours in the very first day is sort of pulling all that together and giving my clinical view of their relationship based on their own individual development and things like that.
04:49
And then we do some psycho. There's some psychoeducation about how the brain works and how it interferes with effective communication and this is, you know, really based in science and I have a lot of good information for people and help them. You know, when I do this in my therapy sessions with my regular clients, there's just a lot of aha moments about, oh that's what's going on. For me, I mean, it's really cutting edge. And so they get to see from a scientific viewpoint why they're getting in these. You know circular conversations and escalating with each other. So there's that piece of it.
05:31
And then you know, there's a couple of experiential exercises that we do together that are really revealing and somewhat diagnostic about what stage of development the couple is in, because I'm trained in the developmental model of couples therapy. Ellen Bader and Pete Pearson from Menlo Park developed it and you know Lori Wiseman sort of developed this model of the intensive and used that information and that clinical research to put into it. So we do the experiential exercises and then we get into really the heart of the work, which is called the initiator-inquirer or eye-to-eye, and it's just really a transformational process that I use to teach people how to listen and speak and put aside some of their own reactions to each other but noticing them. So it's a lot and it's I break it down for people. So I know it sounds like a lot but it's quite fascinating and makes a huge change.
Karen Covy Host
06:45
Yeah, this, I mean it sounds fascinating. There's so many questions that I have now. You mentioned developmental model. I certainly don't have your background in therapy, so you're going to have to educate me here, but when I think of developmental stages, I think of a child like from birth to, however old, until adulthood. Right, I don't think of that in terms of couples, so can you explain what that is and how does that work?
Ann Cerney Guest
07:15
Yeah, no, that's exactly right. We as humans develop, as you know, in a very reliable, predictable way, unless there is something that interferes with that. And couples also are sort of built the same way. They are driven to evolve. So the beginning of a relationship starts out with us being very symbiotic and enmeshed, if you will, not necessarily really looking at the two individuals or striking out our own autonomy. In the beginning we're looking for merging. That's what love feels like. When you fall in love you're like, oh, I want to be one with you. All of that and your difference is oh, who cares? I'm okay with that.
08:06
There's a lot of accommodation and avoiding of looking at conflict and things like that in the beginning, and that lasts for about up to two years and then, naturally, the two individuals within that couple start to emerge and that's when the opportunity exists for the next stage of development, which is differentiation.
08:30
And that's when we learn how to be really transparent with each other about who we are and self-define what it is we want and need, what we think, and we also start seeing our other partner as a separate, being a separate individual from us, and they can have their own thoughts and wants and needs, separate from us and it doesn't define us and people is that that wish for being together, symbiotically, is very strong and there's a fear of abandonment, of loss.
09:16
To move into differentiation is risky, it's, you know, it's like the toddler separating from the mom and having to come back right. Reproachment that's. The next stage is practicing. So when the partners start understanding and moving through differentiation, the next stage is practicing, much like reproachment in human development. And we go out and we say here's who I am and here's what I want to do and I'm going to separate a little bit from my partner but still be attached and you know, as a couple. But we're now two individuals doing our own thing and also coming together in a very healthy way. But a lot of people get stuck in the differentiation stage because it is threatening.
Karen Covy Host
10:08
And then, is that the last stage or are there more stages after that?
Ann Cerney Guest
10:12
There are more stages, but clinically I don't see people in any of those later stages, to be honest, because those are really advanced development stages for couples and they often are not needing a clinician to be involved with them.
Karen Covy Host
10:32
So trust me, correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like if you get past this, the stage that you talked about, the differentiation, if you get as a couple past that stage into some of the more intricate or advanced developmental stages, you're good.
Ann Cerney Guest
10:52
You have the ability now to negotiate to move conflict forward instead of hiding from it or getting embroiled in it. The symbiotic couples are typically either conflict avoidant they keep everything down or they're high conflict and they're not able to move the conflict forward into negotiation. Successful resolution.
Karen Covy Host
11:17
Okay, so that would be the next stages, when you can negotiate, and by then it sounds like you have the skills that you need to keep the relationship on solid ground.
Ann Cerney Guest
11:31
Yeah, skills are important and I think everybody focuses on skills. What has to happen before skills can really develop is capacity has to be developed, and by capacity, I mean developmental capacities. The capacity to actually hear someone, listen to their thoughts, feelings, wishes and not internalize them and make that about yourself. The capacity to be able to see your partner as a separate individual and know that their thoughts and feelings don't define you. Those are really advanced capacities for human interaction.
Karen Covy Host
12:10
Okay, so now you've got me intrigued, because I always thought about capacity kind of as a fixed thing, right, like your capacity might get bigger or smaller if you're under stress, for example. Like when you're stressed, your capacity might get a little smaller. But I thought fundamentally you've got what you got.
Ann Cerney Guest
12:30
Yeah, that's really a great point that you're making, and I think a lot of people, myself included, used to think of capacity. Well, you know, they're at capacity. That's all they can do. What really we're learning is that people can develop capacities. The brain continues to evolve. There are certain people who get stuck in pervasive patterns of interacting with people. We know those people are, and those things usually relate to developmental problems that happen early in life trauma. But even those people, when they want to work towards something in terms of growth, they can develop greater capacity for these things that result in having a much more fulfilling and satisfying rich relationship with their partner.
Karen Covy Host
13:25
That is so interesting, right? That's fascinating, yeah. Yeah, this is totally new territory for me because, like I said, I always thought that the capacity that you were born with was kind of like what you've got is what you've gotten, maybe not born with, but that by the time you're an adult, you've developed your capacity or your limitations, right, whatever they are. And what I hear you saying is that the brain is constantly developing and that you can increase your capacity, you can deal with those limitations and take some of them down, which, once you increase your capacity, you're going to have better relationships, right.
Ann Cerney Guest
14:06
Yes, you've got it, you got it.
Karen Covy Host
14:08
Yeah, I love this. Now you mentioned another word, too, about you know it triggers people's abandonment issues. That in me, reminds me of attachment theory, right? So how does attachment theory play into all of this couples counseling that you do?
Ann Cerney Guest
14:26
Well, it's definitely something that we talk about and it's going to be apparent to me in their responses to the questionnaires that I send out, which is a relationship history and also a personal history. So I'm reading these things and sort of getting a feel right away for where they might fall on the spectrum of attachment and whether it's secure or anxious or avoidant or avoidantly anxious, and so what's interesting is that most people do not seem to find someone with the same attachment style as them. I think we're looking to heal, in subconscious ways, wounds that happened to us in childhood, and so we may choose someone who's like our father, who may have been very distant and unavailable emotionally, and then that starts to surface in our relationship with that partner. And if we don't have the capacity to stay in our own skin and be our self-defined, know who we are, allow our partner to be who they are without it affecting us and our self-esteem, it'll be another additional wound. It'll be, you know, it'll add to the trauma.
Karen Covy Host
15:45
And I know trauma is something that so many people deal with. I think I don't know that there's a human being on the planet that makes it to old age without having some sort of trauma, right. And I know that it's something that takes a long time for many people anyway, a long time to heal, a long time in therapy, right. So if you've got an intensive weekend, how much can you really accomplish in one weekend?
Ann Cerney Guest
16:14
Yeah, and that's a great question, and it really depends on the developmental stage of each of those people who come in as part of the couple and the developmental stage that they're at in their couple relationship is also going to depend on where each person is in their own developmental stage.
16:35
So, you know, I've seen people who are really not even able to identify their own feelings, their own thoughts, that they're very disconnected and saying things that they think their partner wants to hear. They're not necessarily so. That's somebody who's going to take a little bit longer, because to get differentiated from your partner, you have to know what's inside of yourself, and so it's a different way to start with somebody. And I will say that when somebody's a little more advanced and they have already got some good idea of what they're thinking and feeling and who they are, that makes my work a little bit easier in terms of the couple differentiating seeds. You know, and we do the work and the outcome is worth like months of therapy for either. Wherever you are in that spectrum, you're going to have a whole different idea of your relationship and why things are breaking down, and it really, I think, gives people some relief to know these things.
Karen Covy Host
17:52
A hundred percent. And what I love about this is that you know to go back to something you said earlier that you think that so many couples who are on the brink have the you know they could fix the relationship, they could mend the marriage. Now, I'm sure it's not always possible, but the fact that you have more hope than most people that I've talked to and so many of my clients and the people that I'm working with. Look, if they could fix their marriage, they'd love to do that, because going through a divorce, as you know, it sucks, there's a lot to it, and so nobody would voluntarily want to do that if they could fix their marriage. So how can a couple know if their marriage is fixable?
Ann Cerney Guest
18:39
Yeah, I think that. Well, you've heard of discernment counseling. I'm certified in that as well. I think knowing whether it is fixable to me isn't the question. The question is really do you want it to be fixable? How much do you want this to work? How open are you to looking at your part in what's breaking down here? Are you able and willing to entertain that? Maybe there's some things that need to change, and my experience and I've been doing this for about 20 years my experience is the people that don't want to look at themselves at all and believe that is all their partner, that marriage is not going to work, they're not going to fix anything, Because when you come into therapy, you're not coming in to fix your spouse. Coming in to understand how you can do a better job with your spouse at repairing your marriage.
Karen Covy Host
19:41
So when a couple comes to you, do both people in the couple have to be willing to look at themselves? I mean, if one person is open to it and the other person is not, what's the prognosis for that kind of couple?
Ann Cerney Guest
20:00
It's a really a nuanced question. It's a great question. I can't say a blanket statement that, okay, I would not work with those people. However, I do I mean I do, as I said, I've been doing this a while. I have a good idea of somebody who's really checked out and is just looking to sort of put the lid on it and say, okay, we tried one last time and I never want to be in the position of putting the other partner, the one who really wants to work on it, in a position of putting everything out there, while their partner is really just, you know, marking, checking the box. So I'm pretty. Commitment is really important to me, especially for the intensive. If they're, even if they're on the brink, if it's, if they're desperately wishing that they weren't, that's okay.
Karen Covy Host
20:57
I love that. I really love that, because I was just working with a client who is they're on the brink of divorce and they want very different things, and they went back to the marriage counseling for the one last time. But for her it was like her spouse was just checking the box. It's like I don't want to have a good marriage, I just don't want a divorce. I don't want to change the way things are. I like them the way things are. And the other spouse is saying, no, the way things are suck, that's why we're here, that's why we're on the edge of divorce. Either we're going to make it better or we're going to get a divorce. And the spouse was saying well, no, I just want to be the way I am.
Ann Cerney Guest
21:43
I would have some real questions for that partner and wonder, like, what is going on underneath all that that complacency? Is it fear, is it? You know, there usually is anxiety underlying what looks like really bad behavior, I want to say non-collaborative behavior in marriages. Before, maybe, when I was earlier in my career, I would have judged that and said, well, that person really isn't serious. You know that's. But I think now, at this point, I'm more like what is going on for that person? He or she is blocking growth yes, 100%, and that is. You know, we need to continue growing. That's the way we're built.
Karen Covy Host
22:33
You know. But it's interesting you say that because a lot of people think that when they get to a certain age and everybody's got their own idea of what that age is like, okay, I'm done, I'm fully cooked, I don't grow anymore Like, this is just me, and what I hear you saying is not so much.
Ann Cerney Guest
22:53
No, we know now that the brain is continuing to evolve, we have the capacity to continue growing, we have a lot of potential, and a relationship that isn't growing is what it's dying it's dead, yeah yeah. And there's one person usually that says I can't do this anymore. This feels suffocating, or it feels, you know, fill in the blank, I'm not happy. I think, exploring with the other person what is keeping them stuck? You know what is their fear about moving forward, what is going on for them? That's the question, and so I think it's worth it to spend some time with that person. If they're willing to do that, I might just do a one day intensive with that couple and find out can we do this? I need to get a little deeper with you than just a therapy session. Sometimes things can come out that you would be very surprised about.
Karen Covy Host
23:56
Really.
Ann Cerney Guest
23:58
Yeah, fear of failure, fear of judgment.
Karen Covy Host
24:03
Yeah. And that's a lot of things. A lot of people who are especially high, achieving successful people don't like to say I mean they don't think they have fear of anything. Right, that's not me and somebody else could be afraid of. I'm not afraid of that. That whole word gives them anxiety.
Ann Cerney Guest
24:26
Yeah, it's a very good point because a lot of my clients are from you know, the. They are high-achieving people making more money than I ever will see in my life, and so I respect their mindset, their desire not to be vulnerable in the world. It also, I think, part of the program is learning that you can and have to be vulnerable in your important relationship. This is where the only way through is to be vulnerable, the only way forward. Why? Because if you're not being vulnerable, you're acting out of a lot of ineffective behaviors that are just defense mechanisms for that vulnerability.
Karen Covy Host
25:14
Interesting.
Ann Cerney Guest
25:15
Yeah, like denial and resistance, and you know, judgment, criticism, yelling, blaming, all of those are defense mechanisms against some vulnerable feeling.
Karen Covy Host
25:31
Interesting. So what makes, though, do you think, the intensive, more effective than you know? Go to therapy every week, go to marriage counseling every week.
Ann Cerney Guest
25:43
Yeah Well, from my perspective, Karen, I think it's because we get an uninterrupted two days of first laying the groundwork, me reading them doing the work, me putting it together for them, and then we're together and we're going straight from like the learning curve is not as steep because I've got them in my you know attention. I've got their attention for all these hours and then doing the practicing and helping me guide them through that in the eye to eye is just invaluable and there's no interruptions. So I do the eye to eye with some of my couples who are just coming in weekly for therapy and it's never, ever as deep that we can go as it is in an intensive.
Karen Covy Host
26:33
Yeah, because you just don't have the time.
Ann Cerney Guest
26:35
You just don't have the time and I don't want to open something up and then say, oh, we're done, yeah, you know, yeah, it's incredible what that momentum can do. And then after the intensive we meet again three weeks later that's a part of the cost of the intensive for 90 minutes and I check in on how they're doing. I have them do another eye-to-eye with me and I see the eye-to-eye is one of these things where it's a diagnostic exercise where I can see where they're getting stuck. and so I can sort of assess how effective was the intensive for you and what do we need to do now? Maybe we don't need weekly therapy, or even biweekly, but we might need to really keep practicing and coming in monthly or getting on Zoom, yeah, and so a lot of times they don't need weekly therapy sessions after the intensive.
Karen Covy Host
27:30
What's interesting to me about this whole process, though, is when you say two day intensive, I get the view of okay, you walk in, you spend two days, you're done, but it sounds like there's really a lot more to it that you've got to do. There's a lot of pre-work that you do, so people are thinking about a lot of things in their relationship before they get to the intensive. Then there's the intensive, then there's the follow-up, and so it sounds like it really the opportunity to go deep. I can see it. It makes so much sense.
Ann Cerney Guest
28:03
Yeah, it's great and thanks for saying that. They also get a binder it's like this thick to take with them. That has everything we've worked on and talked about, even the psychoeducation about the brain, everything we've talked about. There's a goals section, a couple's goals section and it's all really put together in a way. I mean, I do some crafting of things differently depending on the couple, and it can be put together in a way where it builds on itself and then when they take that binder home, they've got something tangible to refer to and to keep working with.
Karen Covy Host
28:42
Have you ever had couples who because I know you are certified in discernment counseling as well and just let's take a little aside for the listeners who might not know what that is Can you explain what discernment counseling is?
Ann Cerney Guest
28:57
Yeah, discernment counseling is a model that was developed for couples that are called mixed agenda. So it's the couple that comes into therapy and one of them really wants to work on the marriage and the other one is saying I don't think that I'm in this anymore, I don't think this is going to help, I'm really not wanting, not sure I want it. And so Bill Daugherty, a psychologist at the University of Minnesota, developed this model that actually meets both of those people where they're at, and so there's no pretending that you're both here to work on the relationship. It's all out on the table. You're considering divorce or ending the marriage, You're dying to keep it together.
29:38
And we spend only up to five sessions. It's very structured A lot of one-on-one time with each of them, helping them understand more about how they got here and what their contributions were to the problems in their marriage, and then making a decision. Do they want to? Path one, just leave things as they are, defer the decision, or path two, a decision to move towards divorce, formalize the separation? Or are they able to see, with a deeper insight from these sessions, what they might be working on, what they might even want to be working on for themselves In the context of couples therapy for a period of six months, taking all talk of leaving off the table and then reevaluate in six months to see if it's a more viable, sustainable and satisfying relationship.
Karen Covy Host
30:33
That makes so much sense and I've been a big supporter of discernment therapy from the beginning because it makes so much sense. But have you ever had people who a couple who will come for an intensive? They say they want to put the marriage back together. They try and they get to the point where either they're ready for discernment counseling now because somebody's leaning out, or somebody just says I can't do this, I'm done happened to me, but I do know it has happened to some of my colleagues.
Ann Cerney Guest
31:11
I have not been doing intensives for a long time. Like the person who developed this, Lori Wiseman, who's down in Palm Desert. I know she's had that experience with people. What I've had more of is doing discernment, counseling and then having people go to an intensive with me. Instead of the weekly, because we kind of kickstart it.
Karen Covy Host
31:32
Yeah.
Ann Cerney Guest
31:32
Get them kickstarted. If that's what they both want, they have to both choose it, you know. But sure, I'm sure that that could happen. Anything's possible. You know that, but it doesn't sound.
Karen Covy Host
31:42
What I love about what you're saying and you're being very careful and judicious about how you say this, but it doesn't sound what I, what I love about what you're saying and you're being very careful and judicious about how you say this, but it doesn't. It certainly doesn't sound like it happens a lot.
Ann Cerney Guest
31:56
I don't think so now so many people reading because it's a lot of screening, all that pre-work, okay, and I have phone calls with the couple, a Zoom about an hour long before. I even agree to. You know, do this with them. So that is something that I think is really important for the clinician to screen for and be clear about. What are we doing here? Sometimes people are trying to make a decision. Maybe they are kind of on the brink. If they are, I'll try to do discernment with them first.
Karen Covy Host
32:35
Yeah, that makes so much sense. But the hard thing is too, because a lot of times what I've found is people don't really know what they want. Right, they think they want one thing, but when you start to dig down it's something totally different.
Ann Cerney Guest
32:53
Well, that's a great point. Yeah, and you and I know that from the divorce world is like people come in saying we want this kind of relationship or divorce, and then you know when the rubber meets the road. You know we find out when people are squeezed, what's inside comes out. And so, yeah, I think that it's good to spend some time with people before and ask the right questions and get an idea of their history and see patterns that may be there.
Karen Covy Host
33:24
I love that and I like the idea that you screen people before they get into the intensive. I would assume that from time to time people come to you and they don't get past that screening, that you do your screening and you either say, okay, we have to do discernment first, or I don't think the intensive is for you. Does that happen?
Ann Cerney Guest
33:45
That has happened twice in the last month. I'm doing discernment with one of those couples right now and I'm doing separation counseling with another one. And because putting someone in the intensive it is designed for really working on and with an open mind and, you know, hopefully open heart eventually if it's not already, but when someone really has gotten to that point of being out and really knows it. I want to respect that too.
Karen Covy Host
34:18
Yeah, I like to tell my clients. This is my totally unscientific description, but there's a point of no return.
Ann Cerney Guest
34:26
There is a point.
Karen Covy Host
34:27
Yeah, there's a point where you cross that line and you can't go back.
Ann Cerney Guest
34:32
Yeah, and I've been there, so I know what that's like and I do want to respect that. The worst thing I could do for somebody is try to get them to not be where they're at, try and talk them out of whatever place they are. Discernment is about having them consider other things, not change their mind. But just let's look at it from all sides and then you decide.
Karen Covy Host
35:02
I love that and, again, that's one of the reasons why I like discernment as a model for couples, because until you've looked at things from different angles, until you have full information from a variety of perspectives, you can't really make a fully informed decision. And so this helps people do that. I absolutely love that. So another question If people are interested in learning more about this intensive weekend with you, where's the best place for them to find you and to learn about this?
Ann Cerney Guest
35:38
Yeah, my website is CerneyCoaching.com and contact me on there. I've got a whole page about the Intensives and I'm definitely open to answering any questions, so don't hesitate to reach out.
Karen Covy Host
35:54
I love this and thank you so much for everything that you've shared. This has been really enlightening on a lot of levels and I love that it's available. It's an option for people. It's a choice, Because so many times couples get things aren't going well, They've been going downhill for a long time and they think they don't have any choices right.
Ann Cerney Guest
36:16
Yeah, for sure. I think it's good to explore as much as you can before you come to a final decision.
Karen Covy Host
36:22
Yeah, a hundred percent. So, thank you so much and for those of you who are watching and listening, we are going to link to all Ann’s things in the show notes so you'll be able to find her really, really easily and check out the Intensive Weekend if that seems like it's something that might work for you or might be good for you and your spouse. So again, Ann, thank you so much, and thank you to everyone watching or listening. I look forward to seeing and hearing from you again next time and, if you liked the episode give it a thumbs up and please subscribe.
Ann Cerney Guest
36:53
Thanks, Karen.
Karen Covy Host
You're welcome.
