Episode Description - Emotional Intimacy: You Want Connection. He Wants Peace. Now What?
Most people want a strong partnership—but what does it actually take to build one that’s equal, respectful, and emotionally connected? In this conversation, relationship coach Sharon Costanzo breaks down the hidden dynamics that keep couples stuck. Drawing from her work with high-achieving women, Sharon explains how unconscious habits and social conditioning can block true collaboration in marriage—and what it really takes to break those hidden patterns.
Throughout the conversation, Sharon shares candid insights about how to voice your needs without pushing your partner away, how to handle defensiveness and misunderstanding, and why assuming good intent can completely change the tone of a tough conversation.
As the discussion goes deeper, Sharon gets into the messy reality of navigating conflict, resentment, and unmet expectations in long-term relationships. She talks about accountability, emotional fidelity, and how to figure out whether your marriage can still meet your core needs.
Whether you're trying to repair a struggling relationship or just make a good one better, this conversation challenges the idea that love should be effortless—and makes a strong case that real intimacy requires courage, skill, and ongoing negotiation.
Show Notes
About Sharon
Sharon Costanzo is a relationship coach and the founder of Respected & Connected, where she helps high-achieving women create balanced, meaningful partnerships without over-functioning or burning out. With a focus on navigating gender dynamics and fostering equity in relationships, Sharon empowers her clients to advocate for their needs with confidence and compassion. Through her private coaching, 'The Better Marriage Blueprint,' and other resources, she teaches practical strategies to build deeper intimacy and collaboration.
Connect with Sharon
You can connect with Sharon on LinkedIn at Sharon Costanzo and on Facebook at Sharon D Costanzo and you can follow her on Instagram at Respected and Connected. To find out more about Sharon’s work visit her website at Respected and Connected.
Bonus Offer
Sharon is offering a free guide called the Partnership Playbook: five simple steps to share the load, deepen your bond, and create a thriving partnership - without blame or guilt!
Key Takeaways From This Episode with Sharon
- Sharon Costanzo is a relationship coach who helps high-achieving women create balanced partnerships without over-functioning or burning out, with focus on gender dynamics and equity.
- Healthy collaborative relationships require both partners to voice their needs and be willing to be influenced by each other, moving beyond traditional role-based arrangements.
- A primary obstacle to deep connection is the unwillingness to have uncomfortable conversations; strong partnerships involve couples who are willing to "get messy" and work through discomfort.
- When addressing relationship concerns, assuming good intent and using curious language ("Can you help me understand?") rather than accusatory "why" questions leads to better outcomes.
- Women often explain their needs but men hear complaints; shifting from complaints to specific requests about how partners can succeed helps bridge this communication gap.
- Accountability in relationships involves taking responsibility for your own behavior while having mechanisms to follow up on agreements, celebrating progress and addressing setbacks.
- Resentment acts as a wall that protects from hurt but prevents connection; letting go of past hurts requires trust that may need professional support to rebuild.
- Modern relationships place unrealistic expectations on partners to fulfill multiple roles; building broader support systems while protecting the primary relationship is essential.
- Couples benefit from explicit conversations about expectations, as people enter relationships with unwritten rules based on their family backgrounds and personal values.
- If couples struggle with the same issues for more than six months, seeking professional help provides valuable outside perspective that self-help resources cannot.
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Transcript
Emotional Intimacy: You Want Connection. He Wants Peace. Now What?
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
collaboration, accountability, connection
SPEAKERS
Karen Covy, Sharon Costanzo
Karen Covy Host
00:10
Hello and welcome to Off the Fence, a podcast where we deconstruct difficult decision-making so we can discover what keeps us stuck and, more importantly, how we can get unstuck and start making even tough decisions with confidence. I'm your host, Karen Covy, a former divorce lawyer, mediator and arbitrator, turned coach, author and entrepreneur. And now, without further ado, let's get on with the show.
With me today I have the pleasure of speaking with Sharon Costanzo, and Sharon is a relationship coach and the founder of Respected and Connected, a program where she helps high-achieving women create balanced, meaningful partnerships without over-functioning or burning out, with a focus on navigating gender dynamics and fostering equity in relationships, Sharon empowers her clients to advocate for their needs with confidence and compassion. Through her private coaching program, the Better Marriage Blueprint and other resources, she teaches practical strategies to build deeper intimacy and collaboration.
01:21
Sharon, welcome to the show.
Sharon Costanzo Guest
Yeah, I'm so glad to be here.
Karen Covy Host
I'm happy to have you, and I wanted to talk about all things relationships with you, if that's okay, of course. Yeah.
Sharon Costanzo Guest
01:33
I'm an open book.
Karen Covy Host
01:34
Awesome. So let's start with talking about relationships and what, in your experience and in your opinion, makes for a healthy and collaborative relationship.
Sharon Costanzo Guest
01:49
Yeah, I think I mean it's so interesting to think about collaboration in relationships, I think, especially like a heterosexual relationship where men and women are coming from such different angles, such different ways of being socialized. Just thinking about I mean, I'm always thinking about it you know, what does our society reward women for doing? It's kind of for being accommodating, for making sure everyone else is okay, and men are often rewarded for, you know, being really high, achieving, being powerful at work, kind of just expecting, you know, if I achieve well, then people, especially my wife, is going to kind of reward me for that and accommodate me, and even though culture has shifted so much. We haven't really figured out, I think, as a society. What does it mean to have a collaborative relationship in a romantic sense? We can collaborate at work, but how do we, you know, collaborate and kind of have that give and take?
03:00
I think a big part of it is both parties need to learn how to voice their needs and wants in the relationship and both parties need to learn how to be influenced by their partner and to kind of receive and consider and maybe even negotiate. I know before you and I, when we were kind of planning this episode, you know, legalistically, negotiation might be a little bit different than what it looks like in an intimate relationship. But how do we kind of put it out there, like this is what I want, this is what I think I need, and talk through it and make a relationship that's really going to work for both of us in a different way than maybe it used to be, where marriage was more of kind of just a business arrangement. You know, I'll be the breadwinner, I'll be the homemaker, and we'll have this very role-based relationship where we don't really have to have these hard conversations.
Karen Covy Host
04:01
Yeah, I, you know we both work in different ways but in the same kind of space with people and I see so many people who really they want the partnership, they want the collaborative relationship, but the most common obstacles to creating the deep partnership and the deep connection that most people really want?
Sharon Costanzo Guest
Yeah, I think there's a few things you know, like I mentioned before, being able to recognize what we want and need and then voice it and then work through that hard, messy conversation, and I think part of that, along with it, it's a willingness to be uncomfortable and to kind of push and stretch yourself a little bit, to let go of that kind of romantic idea that if it's right, it's going to be easy.
04:59
And I think the strongest partnerships are the couples who are both willing to kind of get in there and get messy and be uncomfortable and accept that that's part of the deal. You know, rocking the boat is part of the deal and having the confidence that we can get through it. You know we're both committed to a hopefully mutually beneficial outcome and we're going to keep kind of working on it. I use the term troubleshooting because my background's in engineering, so you know, when we set out to start something and it doesn't go the way that we want it to, what do we do next? Do we just say oh, say oh? You know, I think we're getting so much content on social media about relationships that lacks the nuance of like if it's meant to be. If they care, they would show up some of those types of things and it's like, well, maybe we do care and we just need, we just have some rough edges to work through.
Karen Covy Host
06:05
Yeah, it's, it's like everybody. The other thing that I find interesting, too, is if they care, they will fill in the blank. Right, my spouse, my partner, will do X, but caring shows up differently, like what might. What I might think shows that my spouse cares about me might be different than what my spouse thinks or feels, right. So how do people get into that? How do they have the messy conversations without creating a conflict that blows up the relationship?
Sharon Costanzo Guest
06:42
Yeah, I think the very first part is to just assume good intent. You know, that was like a big eye opening lesson for me to learn earlier in my marriage. And so assume good intent. And I was just as you were kind of talking. I was thinking also about kind of a stereotypical conflict that couples have. You know, the woman says like I don't feel emotionally supported, like I ask you about your day and I ask you what's going on in your life and you don't do the same for me and I don't feel emotionally supported. And it's like, okay, well, how do we talk about that?
07:24
And assuming good intent, you know, assuming, like you said, I think that you care about me and maybe you know, if you're a stereotypical man, the way that you care is by going to work and providing an income and you know, being that strong, invulnerable force in the relationship. And what we're asking for now as women is I want more of that emotional connection. So I think a very good place to start is like, hey, I really do believe that you care about me and when I ask you about your day and try and have these conversations and you don't reciprocate it, it doesn't feel. I don't interpret that as caring in the way that I want to be cared about. Is that something that you're willing to work on with me?
Karen Covy Host
08:17
When you’re having that conversation. I'm curious is it helpful or harmful to say like right at that point? I don't feel I don't interpret your behavior in the way that you know, in the way that I think it's intended. Why do you talk this way? Why do you present, why don't you ask me about my feelings or my day or whatever? Is why a helpful question or not?
Sharon Costanzo Guest
08:52
Yeah, I think it depends on the level of like security that you have in the relationship, because I think often why comes across like why often shoots up our defenses? Because it implies like there's something wrong with what you're doing. Yeah, and so I think a more helpful question is like, can you help me understand where you're coming from? There's more curiosity and openness and receptivity, and it's like I accept that, that you're showing up with good intentions, and I just want to understand that better because I believe you know, I think one of the things that really troubled couples get troubled about is is just not not not believing that what their partner's doing makes sense. Yeah, like I believe makes sense. It might not be like really helpful and functional for the kind of relationship that we want, but I believe you know, just based on how you've learned to be in relationships, that it makes sense to you to do what you're doing.
Karen Covy Host
09:57
Yeah, I that that actually, and I think that goes back to the. You know it's the presuming good intent that you know, but realizing, recognizing that we're all raised differently and we have we all have different needs and ways of showing up. But what I see so often where couples go astray is that they're afraid to voice those needs. They're afraid of the conflict that might come if they're honest. So how can people, do you have any tips for what people could use to help them stop avoiding conflict and actually say what they need?
Sharon Costanzo Guest
10:42
Yeah, I think part of it is accepting that it's going to be uncomfortable. Again, I come back to that. I think a lot of especially the women I work with, you know high achieving, really conscientious women. They tend to overthink like and there's this belief that if I bring it up in the right way at the right time, then I can avoid some of that discomfort and my perspective is maybe just shoot for like 70% being good enough, you know, a good enough time and a good enough way to bring things up.
11:21
And one of the stories that I share it's kind of a little bit of a vulnerable telling story. But I was in this position, you know, earlier in my marriage when my kids were really little, when we were like, at least for me I was, I was miserable and things weren't working out and I had tried bringing things up in the best way that I could. Now, knowing what I know now, I would do it differently. I was doing a lot more complaining than requesting, but things I just didn't feel like I was getting through to my husband and I had to do the best I could to, you know, kind of put a stake in the ground and I just said like this is really important to me that we address this concern that I'm having, and if things don't change, I don't know if I want to be married anymore oh and of course, that's a pretty like big thing to bring up and he didn't respond the way that I expected him to.
12:21
You know, I think a lot of women we have this fantasy that when we bring something up, then they're gonna be like oh my gosh, you're totally right, I'm so sorry. And that's not usually what happens. I think like we've been thinking about and processing this for probably months, or maybe even years, before we even say anything, and we're like probably taking them completely off guard, and so I think we need to expect them to take a little bit of time to digest it and for maybe we're not going to get the response that we want.
Karen Covy Host
12:55
Well, what happens then? You like and I can relate, obviously, being a woman right, you say something bothers you, you think about it, you stew about it, it happens again. You're going to talk about it. You're, you plan the conversation, you go over it a million times in your head, you finally deliver the conversation and it does not land the way that you had hoped that it would. Then what?
Sharon Costanzo Guest
13:22
Then I think you give them a little bit of space to kind of process and think through it and also just say, hey, I know we're going to have to talk about this again, like it's not a one-time conversation. I think that's another kind of misconception that we have is that we're going to be able to have one conversation and things are going to be totally put on another trajectory. But no, we're going to. We're going to be talking about it, and I might even shift my position as well as I hear some feedback from my partner about what their experience is. You know, like I said, I was complaining a lot early in my marriage and I didn't even realize what a problem that was, because nobody showed me a different way to do it.
Karen Covy Host
14:09
Yeah, I want to stop you right here because this is so important. I have heard from so many people. So many women are complaining in the relationship, but they don't. We don't perceive it as complaining, but our husbands, our spouses do right. So where's the disconnect? How can a woman understand if what she thinks is explaining her husband is interpreting as complaining?
Sharon Costanzo Guest
14:37
Yeah, that's such a good point, cause I do feel like we feel like we're explaining, yeah, and. And the phrase I hear often is I just need my husband to understand, and if he would understand then obviously he would want to change to make me happy. You know, and I do think it goes back to the way that we're conditioned and communicate like, I think, as women, we, we hear complaints and we're just like, oh yeah, obviously, obviously, but for men, the way that they're conditioned, and I don't think it's always biology, I think it's society and patriarchy and all of those things but they look at every interaction like am I, am I winning or am I losing?
Karen Covy Host
15:19
I know so not helpful.
Sharon Costanzo Guest
15:22
And so when they hear that, they're like, oh, I'm losing, I'm losing in this relationship and it was a big shift for me and it's a big shift for a lot of my clients to be like, oh well, why don't we tell them how they can be successful instead of telling them how they're getting it wrong?
Karen Covy Host
15:41
Okay, say more about that. What do you mean?
Sharon Costanzo Guest
15:43
Yeah. So, like an example, you know, I want more emotional connection in the relationship. A man's like I don't know what that means.
Karen Covy Host
15:52
Exactly, and the guys are like they're standing there confused because again going back to how we started, what they're doing they think builds an emotional connection. And the woman's like oh, that is so, not it. Yeah, so where do you go from there? What's the next step?
Sharon Costanzo Guest
16:09
So I mean, every woman is different, and that's the thing that I think we also get wrong is we think there's like some golden rule for all relationships and they should know it because we know it, but really we are individuals. You know what. What looks like emotional connection to me might not be to someone else and like, like, for example, my husband, he doesn't need to like talk about work and process things and that type of thing, but I might just need like hey, can I have 10 minutes to just vent to you about what's going on at work? And when you respond to me, could you not be like oh yeah, I can see why you have a problem with that person based on how you're interacting.
16:50
You know, one of the examples I had was, you know, I have one child that's neurodivergent and they can be really challenging to deal with, and I was having an issue with this child and I went to my husband about it and he was like, well, you do kind of um, I can't remember what he said like she's really good at pushing your buttons, or something like that.
17:14
And I went to him and said you know what I'm looking for in that like is could you just say to me like you're doing a great job as a parent and I know that this child can be really hard Like could you offer me some like validation and reassurance, instead of being like, oh well, you know, get going into your problem solving mode, which is a pretty typical reaction in a lot of I mean, we do it too as women, but it's a pretty typical interaction and so we just ask for what we want.
17:47
You know, like, I know that what you're doing is, of course, trying to be helpful, but what would be more helpful for me is if you would respond this way Can you do that? And if it's a request, then they can say yes or no, which is also a vulnerable thing and I think that's why we go back to complaints, because when we complain we don't have to hear no, but when we request we have to be open to the fact that you know they get a choice and whether they want to give us what we're asking for at any given moment.
Karen Covy Host
18:21
So let's say you as a woman, you do hear. No, no, I can't do that, that's. And, and a lot of times what happens is the husband will say that's just. That's not who I am, that's not the way I am, I don't do that. Okay, now where does the conversation go from there?
Sharon Costanzo Guest
18:41
yeah. Well, I mean, we could get curious and ask like what's behind that, what, what's going on there? If that's a no, is there something else that maybe you would be willing to offer? That would still help me feel, you know, more reassured or more connected in the relationship. We can kind of again go back to kind of some of those exploratory conversations. Another really powerful way to respond, um, and terry real he's. He calls it relational empowerment. You know, what can I do for you to help you show up for me this way, like what are you missing in the relationship? That I think this might feel more reciprocal if I'm more giving to you in a way that you would like to receive.
Karen Covy Host
19:30
Yeah, and so, and I love that and it is. It's about having the conversation and not accepting an answer that you don't like at face value, but getting what I call underneath it, you know, and asking those questions. You know being curious, asking questions about why, and okay, is there another way that we can resolve the conflict and both feel validated and heard?
Sharon Costanzo Guest
19:59
Yeah, yeah, and I think a lot of times, especially in like a stereotypical, lot of times, especially in like a stereotypical male female relationship, men hold back on granting requests because they've had bad experiences in the past with no matter what they do, it doesn't ever seem good enough. And so I think one of our kind of work as women is to be able be willing to accept, you know, a 50 or a 70, or maybe even a 15, if it's more than zero. You know, being willing to accept less than perfection and building on that, rather than going into this kind of all or nothing trap that we get into.
Karen Covy Host
20:45
Yeah, the whole, all of the black and white thinking. Well, let's just put it this way, it's not very collaborative, right, exactly. But you know, I'm curious can you talk about accountability in a relationship too? Can you talk to the audience about what does accountability mean to you in terms of a relationship, and how do you, you know, how do you get it?
Sharon Costanzo Guest
21:12
Yeah, I mean for me it's am I taking responsibility for how I'm showing up in this relationship? Like that's my personal accountability. And also, you know, if my partner has agreed to something and they're not fulfilling their agreement, what does that conversation look like to follow up with? You know, and I think that's a big part that's missing in the way we're kind of trained as couples is there's not really a mechanism of accountability in most relationships.
21:45
So if you have, you know, had one of these conversations like hey, I would like to maybe even just go on a date once a week and I as the woman don't want to be planning the date getting the babysitter, you know, doing all of the arrangements, like what feels like a more reciprocal way of doing that. And then maybe in a month or two, let's talk about how it's going and if it's working, we should celebrate that, if and we should celebrate any effort to make it, you know, to make changes positive in the relationship, and if it's not working, can we talk about what's going on, why it's not working Again, what do you need from me to make it worth your while to put in this effort? What do I need from you to feel cared about. It doesn't sound very sexy, but it helps to kind of remove that resentment from the relationship so that you can really enjoy and cherish each other.
Karen Covy Host
22:54
Yeah, Talk a little bit more about that, because I think what I've seen with so many marriages is that one person doesn't talk about their needs or they say, oh, I've asked a million times, he never listens to me, or I never get what I want from her. I always feel blah, blah, blah, blah, blah and that resentment then builds inside because they stop talking. Because what good is it right? When you're at that point and there already is a level of resentment most likely on both sides, both people have some resentment built up. How do you start to cut through that so you can get back to the connection that you really want?
Sharon Costanzo Guest
23:38
Yeah, I think there's kind of a few different elements that help with that help with that. One of them is you know, if there is a behavior going on in the marriage that's creating resentment, can we address that behavior and start to create a little bit of movement in that area?
23:59
Whether it's you know not being honest or not helping out with chores or whatever the case might be. Can we make some sort of movement in that, in a direction that's going to be more collaborative for both people in the relationship? And then the person who is holding on to that resentment has a hard job to do, and that's to open up their heart and receive what their partner's willing to offer. Resentment is like a wall in a relationship, like it can make you feel really protected from being hurt, but it can also prevent you from really connecting and enjoying each other.
Karen Covy Host
24:45
Right, and I think so many people are unwilling or unable to let it go or, more likely, they just don't know how, because the fear is well this you know I asked you for this, I didn't get it. Now I'm upset, Now I have this resentment built up and if I let it go, the same thing is just going to happen again and I'm going to get hurt again. So how can somebody start to chip away at that resentment and trust? Because I think fundamentally, that's what we're talking about is you're trusting that the other person won't just hurt you again.
Sharon Costanzo Guest
25:32
Yeah, yeah, and I think we kind of we do have to train ourselves. You know, as a as a practitioner, as a coach with my client, I would be like do you want to work on your relationship or do you want to protect yourself from ever being hurt again? Um, and of course that's. You know, that's a really simplistic way of looking at it. But, yeah, we can't do both.
Karen Covy Host
25:54
It's a really hard thing to do, so if somebody is like, well, okay, yeah, I really want this marriage to work, I want this relationship to be better, but I don't know how to like, there's so much buildup, there's so much water under the bridge, I don't even I don't even know how to go about clearing it out so that I can actually use the bridge again.
Sharon Costanzo Guest
26:21
Yeah, and I think it's. It's a little different for every person. I think it's really helpful to get you know a coach or a therapist, somebody kind of lending you your adult, their adult brain and being like you know and I've had this conversation in couples therapy as well Like, ah, you know there's so much hurt, there's so much pain from the past. And she's like, well, when was the last time he did that? And I'm like, well, it's been like more than two years, you know. It's like, well, you guys are both different people now. Like, are you willing to accept that and receive it and not harbor, you know, the past pain of the relationship. You guys have both grown up and that's harder when it's been more recent that those hurts have happened.
27:15
But that's why, again, I say, I think it's so helpful to have a really skilled coach or therapist on your side to kind of help. You see, okay, we're moving, we're growing, we're getting past these things, we're both making an effort, we've made some agreements, we have some accountability in the relationship now that we didn't have in the past and we're working towards something. And I'm willing to maybe put all of that resentment into a bag, maybe even imagine it and put that aside so that I can work on the relationship that we have right now. And if I'm not able to let go of that resentment, if I just don't have it in me, is this a relationship like you know, this is the work that you do Is this a relationship that is really going to be fulfilling for us?
Karen Covy Host
28:12
Right, I mean, I think it always to me. For me, it always comes back to what is it that you want, you know? Do you want the deep connection with your spouse, your current spouse? Because if the answer to that is yes, then you can't get to that place without letting go of hurts and resentments. Nobody is perfect, by the way, including you so, and including me, and including every human on the planet. So if you're not willing to let go of some of that hurt, you can't get to the connection that you want. And if that's not what you want, okay, then admit that to yourself, and then it's time to make other plans.
Sharon Costanzo Guest
28:58
Right, and a big part of that, I think, also is a grieving process. You know there's grief associated with a relationship. Even if you choose to stay in the relationship, there's a grief of this partner is not going to meet every single one of my needs and heal all of my hurts and do all of that for me. That's our kind of fantasy. But am I willing to let go of and grieve some of those things that I'm not getting from this relationship so that I can enjoy the things that I am getting from it?
Karen Covy Host
29:38
You know you bring up a really good point. It's something Esther Perel talks about. It's that we have. So we place so many demands on our intimate relationship today that didn't exist even 50 years ago, let alone a hundred or more than that right. We expect our partner to be our best friend, our lover, our confidant, our, you know, like our everything and, to your point, heal all of our wounds and be everything for us, all in one person. If that's not a realistic expectation and it certainly doesn't seem to be, how much do you think that a person could or should go outside of the marriage to find the best friend or the business partner or the you know, whatever it is that they're looking for all in their spouse? Is that OK to do or does that ultimately erode the marriage?
Sharon Costanzo Guest
30:40
I don't think it erodes the marriage. To like, broaden your support system, I think you know if, if monogamy is a is a commitment and a value that you hold in your marriage, then you do what you can to protect that, that commitment in the marriage. You know I do deal with clients who there's been some emotional infidelity in the relationship and for a lot of people they value emotional infidelity or they value emotional fidelity as well and not having like someone other than your significant other be your primary emotional support. You know you don't go and complain to someone of the same sex about your relationship and form that kind of bond with someone else. Um, so there are, I think, some kind of commitments and agreements that you can make about what does fidelity mean to us? You know how involved are in-laws in our day-to-day life. You know how do we protect the sanctity of this primary relationship and also know that my husband's not going to talk to me like a girlfriend. You know my husband's not going to, you know, be my biggest cheerleader with every single one of my career goals but at the end of the day is there. Can I rely on him to be, you know, a stable source of support. Do I trust him? Do I feel close to him? Are we fostering some sort of connection?
32:11
And you know, just like you said I love Esther Perel saying that too like we're meant to live in like a community of 50 people, right, and we don't have that anymore. Like we have to go out and work to cultivate that, like to build a community and, to you know, have those friends. And another thing I've learned I'm a very like emotional, introverted person. Not every single woman who's a friend of mine is a confidant, like my daughter's. You know, my daughter's best friend's mom is my friend but we don't really share any intimate details of our lives. But she fills a purpose in my life. You know, we need maybe five to seven good, reliable friends who fill different purposes in our lives. They're not all emotional confidants. That's kind of a way of looking at it too.
Karen Covy Host
33:07
Yeah, and I think you touched on something really important, which is what does fidelity mean to you? What does marriage mean to you? We all go into marriage with unwritten rules and we assume that our rules are the same as our spouse's rules, but we never have those conversations.
33:30
And so what do you think about? Is there a way that people can start to talk about what their expectations are of a marriage and obviously it'd be best to have those conversations before you're married, but you find yourself in a marriage or in a relationship with somebody already. I mean, is there value in talking about what you think marriage is?
Sharon Costanzo Guest
33:57
Oh, definitely, I think you covered a really great point, which is we kind of have these implicit ideas about what we think it should be. And, you know, if we get married young and you know, and we just expect that everyone's family operates the same way. And then we learned that, like our spouse grew up in a family where their parents never fought but they never really had hard conversations, and that seems just absolutely bonkers to somebody who grows up in a family that's really vocal and, you know, gets things off their chest, and so we kind of learn the family styles are different and how do we want to handle conflict in our marriage? How do we want to handle finances? How, you know, what does fidelity mean? How do we handle relationships with people of the opposite sex? Everyone kind of has different rules and ideas about how that should work. So we do need to be having some of those explicit conversations and also be willing to kind of compromise, meet in the middle. Unless something is a total deal breaker value, am I willing to shift my expectations in order to have a secure mutual relationship with this person?
Karen Covy Host
35:32
yeah, and it, and I think the answer is going to be different for every person in every different set of circumstances, and it all comes back to, We sort of come full circle to what do you want? What does having a committed relationship mean to you? What does it mean to your spouse? And are you willing to take responsibility for voicing those needs and having the conversations that allow you to create that relationship?
Sharon Costanzo Guest
35:55
Yeah, yeah. I think a lot of people kind of come with this kind of fantasy, like if I have to ask, then it doesn't, it doesn't mean as much.
Karen Covy Host
36:04
You know it reminds me I'm going to date myself now, but it reminds me of a movie from way back in the day. It was the 1970s. It was a love story, right, and the famous line from the movie was love means never having to say you're sorry. And at this stage in life, I have to say I don't know what kind of relationship they were in, but that's not been my experience.
Sharon Costanzo Guest
36:32
No, and sorry doesn't mean like I'm a bad person and I did something wrong. Sorry means like I tell this to my kids because they're you know, they're eight and ten and they're figuring all this out. Like sorry means like I did something that makes it hard for us to be close. And I want to be close, like I say to my kids, like we want to have good feelings with each and so if we do something that hurts that connection, then we say sorry, not like I'm a bad person and I did something wrong, but what I do has an impact on you, right? And if it impacts you negatively, like if I care about you, of course I want to take responsibility for that and figure out what I can do to amend that.
Karen Covy Host
37:25
Yeah, 100. We can go on talking forever and ever and ever. But you know, before I, before I bring this to a wrap, for those people who are listening and they may be struggling in their marriage, they want, want to make it work, but it's just not working at the moment. What's the best piece of advice you could give them?
Sharon Costanzo Guest
37:46
If they want to make it work and it's just not working. I mean, I think if you've been struggling with the same thing for more than six months or a year, then get some help, like get an outside perspective. I think, especially with the community that I work with, you know high achieving, conscientious women. We really value being able to figure things out on our own and being capable and I think to just for lack of a better word just humble yourself and be like. You know, I don't think I can figure this out on my own, and that doesn't mean there's anything wrong with me. It probably means that I didn't have healthy role models to do what I'm trying to do, right, or I'm stuck in some story or something. And if you can kind of dislodge that a little bit and get a different perspective and maybe learn some more sophisticated skills for relating to your partner, it can make a huge difference.
Karen Covy Host
38:47
Yeah, I mean, we all get so immersed in our own experience that we can't see the forest for the trees. I love that advice to go get help, because sometimes that outside perspective can make a huge difference.
Sharon Costanzo Guest
39:02
Yeah, yeah. And it's so different, I think, to interact with another human being than it is to listen to a podcast or read a book, Because whatever we're doing on our own is filtered through the lens of our experience and our story. So it is again. It all comes back to kind of vulnerability and being willing to be uncomfortable. If I go to someone else, they might tell me some things that I don't want to hear, but it will be for my benefit in the end to be willing to be open to that and explore what I really can do to improve things.
Karen Covy Host
39:43
Yeah Well, Sharon, thank you so much for being a guest on the podcast, for sharing all of your wisdom. If people want to learn more, if they want to, you know look you up and look into your work. Where is the best place for them to find you?
Sharon Costanzo Guest
39:57
Oh, I would say either Instagram or my website and my Instagram handle is Sharon double underscore Costanzo. You try and find a handle and then you just you figure it out, you just do what works. And so, Sharon, double underscore Costanzo, and Costanzo is such a hard name to spell, but it's C-O-S-T-A-N-Z-O, and then my website is just SharonCostanzo.com.
Karen Covy Host
40:26
That's wonderful and, for those of you who are listening or watching, everything is going to be linked underneath in the show notes, so you should be able to find Sharon and look her up with no problem. Sharon, thank you again for being here and so generously sharing your wisdom, sharing your experience and expertise. I really appreciate it.
Sharon Costanzo Guest
Yeah, thank you.
Karen Covy Host
Okay, for those of you who are out there listening, who are out there watching, if you enjoyed today's episode, if you would like to hear more content, just like this, do me a big favor. All you have to do is like the episode, give it a thumbs up, subscribe to the podcast, subscribe to the YouTube channel, and I look forward to talking with you again next time. Thank you.
