Harnessing Intuition for Better Decision-Making with Veronica Drake

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Episode Description

Have you ever felt a gentle whisper in your soul, urging you to take a leap of faith that doesn’t seem logical in the moment? Veronica Drake, an intuitive coach, helps midlife female entrepreneurs reconnect with their inner voice so that they can make better decisions and find creative solutions to their business and personal problems. 

In this podcast episode, Veronica shares the story of her own leap of faith from a stable corporate gig to a path less traveled, guided by the whispers of intuition. Veronica unveils the intricate dance between intellect and intuition, shedding light on the societal conditioning that may have muted our intuitive senses. 

Veronica explains how to become attuned to the subtle signs of expansion and contraction that reveal our intuitive voice. She also describes how to use that voice in making daily choices, and shares actionable tips to rekindle the connection to our intuition, paving the way for personal and professional growth.

Show Notes

About Veronica

Veronica  helps creative, ambitious women entrepreneurs break through the barriers standing between them and the next level income. Veronica is NOT your ordinary business coach. She will not help you figure out your numbers, or strategize and analyze your marketing but she will help you to design a business that serves the lifestyle you’re longing to live at this point in your life.

Connect with Veronica

You can connect with Veronica on LinkedIn at Veronica Drake and on Facebook at Veronica Drake. You can follow Veronica on her YouTube channel at @VeronicaDrake and on Instagram at @Veronicadrakeofficial.  To find out how to work with Veronica visit her website at Veronica Drake where you can also join her free online community.

Key Takeaways From This Episode with Veronica

  • Veronica  helps women get back in touch with their intuition by noticing whether thoughts or impulses make you feel expanded (which signals intuition) or contracted (which signals ego/conditioning).
  • For major life decisions, she suggests listing out all the intuitive "hits" first without judgment, then analyzing them intellectually to create an action plan that unites intuition and logic.
  • Intuition is an inner knowing or subtle guidance that comes from a connection to something greater than ourselves (universe, source, God, etc.).
  • Major life changes (death, divorce, etc.) often prompt the desire to reconnect with intuition when the current path feels unfulfilling.
  • Staying stuck in an unfulfilling situation due to fear/what-ifs can lead to disease from suppressed energy.
  • Making decisions is an ongoing practice of taking incremental steps, observing results, and adjusting - like crossing a creek rock by rock.
  • Intuition will never lead you astray if you're willing to be uncomfortable and make necessary changes with an open mind.
  • The Intuitive Incubator helps midlife women business owners develop their intuition to take their businesses to the next level in an authentic way.
  • Key to trusting intuition is taking calculated small steps/risks first and being willing to get back up if you slip.

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Harnessing Intuition for Growth:  Midlife Decision-Making with Veronica Drake 


 intuition, intellect, decision making


Karen Covy,  Veronica Drake

Karen Covy Host00:10

Hello and welcome to Off the Fence, a podcast where we deconstruct difficult decision-making to help us figure out what keeps us stuck and, more importantly, how do we get unstuck. I'm your host, Karen Covey, a former divorce lawyer, mediator and arbitrator, turned coach, author and entrepreneur. With me today is Veronica Drake. Veronica runs the Intuitive Incubator for midlife business women. She helps creative, ambitious female entrepreneurs break through the barriers standing between them and the next level income. By merging their intuition and intellect for creative, out-of-the-box solutions that enable them to grow their business in a holistic, natural way. Veronica helps these business owners reach new heights. Veronica, thank you so much. Welcome to the show.

Veronica Drake Guest01:54

Oh, thank you for having me, I'm excited to be here.

Karen Covy Host01:57

I'm excited to talk about this because this is, quite honestly, something that I've never talked about on the podcast before, and that is intuition. Now, I know that word brings up a lot of different ideas in a lot of different people's minds, so when you talk about intuition, what does that mean to you? What is intuition?

Veronica Drake Guest02:21

So I will take a really long story and make it really short. I believe that when we came into this life as a human, we were hardwired with a direct connection to something bigger than we are. I don't care if you call it universe, source, God or Bob, it doesn't matter. Whatever you want to call it, you're hardwired, you have a direct connection. And that direct connection is that inner knowing. Right, it's what it comes from somewhere and it comes into your body. And so, for me, that is what intuition is. It's a subtle knowing that comes from somewhere externally, and that's my simple explanation for it.

Karen Covy Host03:13

Okay, so how do you help people get in touch or in tune with that subtle knowing? Because you said we come into this world hardwired that way. My suspicion is just from having been on the planet more years than I care to admit to, that you lose that connection at some point or it becomes less easy to tune in. So how do you help people get in touch with their intuition?

Veronica Drake Guest03:42

Well, ironically we lose that connection very early on my dear because there's this thing called limiting beliefs and conditioning, right.


So we come into this world and you know, we know that we're hungry, we know that our diaper's full, we know these certain things like we just know, right, and our natural reaction is this just doesn't feel right, something's uncomfortable, and so we know what that is. That's a very simplified version of it. Right, hot stove or more. Society teaches us how to believe certain things about certain people and cultures and systems, and right, so we're conditioned. And so that conditioning also includes hey, you need to do it this way and you need to do it that way.


And then all of a sudden it gets noisy and we lose that subtle, gentle knowing and we exchange that for these hard conditioned facts and I use air quotes because whose facts are they? Are they ours or are they given to us? And so we just get disconnected. And I would say, typically that happens around age six or seven, when we start getting into the world. Right, we go to school and then we're open to all these other possibilities, and then we got the self-esteem component and we've got the confidence component, and all of these things play a factor in our ability to stay in touch in tune with the inner knowing.

Karen Covy Host05:30

So it sounds like I mean, this is just part of the human condition. Right, you have to learn as a child like don't touch the hot stove, to your point or you're going to be burned, and every parent is going to do that, presumably for their children or to their children. However you look at that, how do you then later on in life because you deal with women in midlife correct Transition, yeah, Transition, Transition and midlife. So by then you got some years under your belt, you got a little bit of conditioning to work with, right. So how do you help people get underneath that conditioning to hear the voice again?

Veronica Drake Guest06:14

So typically I call them the D's. Every woman and usually it's around 45-ish, 50-ish she hits a D death, disease, disaster or divorce she hits a D and she goes OMG, what? Now something feels off. I don't know what to do. I've been doing this and it's not been working. I feel like there should be more All of this familiar language, because every woman that comes to me says the same thing.


And so, boom, she hits a D. She goes there's got to be more. And where do you go? Right, you go to your girlfriends. You go to a self-help book. You go to a guru. You go to maybe, you go to your religion, whatever, you go to these places, but these are places you've already been right. Think about the girlfriend. You sit down and you have a glass of wine, she has good intentions, right, she's there, she's the listener. But you've been there, you've done this, and all of a sudden it becomes this monotonous rehashing, and so the key to getting out of that is to deepen the relationship with  self-awareness, and that's where it all begins.

Karen Covy Host07:45

But you know that's a beautiful thing to say, but how do you do that? Because, quite honestly, by the time you get to a certain age in life or a certain stage in life, like you hit a D, getting that self-awareness, you don't even know what. Like when you feel something or you hear the voice in your head, how do you know? Is that you? Is that the conditioning? Is that something your parents or teachers or somebody dumped on you at some point in life? Like, how do you discern what is the voice? What's that self-awareness?

Veronica Drake Guest08:23

The discernment is very easy and this is the benchmark. I tell my clients Okay, if the information coming in, we'll call it coming in or you're receiving, expands you, that's your higher, greater good information. If it contracts you, if it makes you go, oh, oh, I don't know how, I can't figure, I don't know. And there's a billion questions that are heavy after it. That's probably conditioning ego. Been there, done that. That's the easiest formula for it. Now again, self-awareness. You have got to notice. It's your job to notice what comes in. So if you take a way to work every day and you drive the same route every day to work and all of a sudden one day you go I don't know why, but I should just go a different way Maybe I'm going to turn left today and you're okay with that decision, right, like it's not. Like you go into it 12,000 stories about why you're turning left and you turn left and all of a sudden you're like you feel, okay, I'm back on the road, I'm there and you get to work and you see an article on the phone Well, there was a three car accident and you would have been stuck in traffic and you would have been late for your meeting and you know. So you just get that. Now it's going to feel uncomfortable, it really is, and you're going to question it and you're going to go really, really, what happens if I turn left? You know what happens.


My suggestion is use the expansion contraction mode If it expands you. If you go, oh, turn left, and all of a sudden that instant hit is okay, I can do that. It's going to be a nanosecond until you learn to develop it, right. So if it expands you and you turn left, just go with the flow. Easier said than done, because the brain is wired for familiarity. Familiarity keeps us safe, but it also keeps us stuck. People, women in marriages, in relationships, who just keep showing up right, they just keep showing up. But it hurts, whether it hurts emotionally, physically, mentally, it hurts. Let me just keep doing this because, well, it's what I've always done. Here's the number one reason women won't listen to that nudge, that gut feeling, that expansion. Here's the number one reason, because it will require change and most women don't like change.

Karen Covy Host11:09

Is this a female thing or is it a human thing?

Veronica Drake Guest11:12

It is a human thing, and I'm speaking to the females because the majority of the work I do is with females. However, women's intuition, it is a male thing also. It just happens to be called women's intuition for whatever reason, but absolutely it's a male thing.

Karen Covy Host11:32

Okay, so it sounds like this is a human thing both ways, and you work with women, and I understand that. But let's say you've got a woman and she's, you know, one of the decisions this podcast is about. How do you make decisions, and what I'm hearing you say is one of the factors is to listen to that little voice. But let's say it's not a decision about turn left or turn right. Let's say you're facing a big decision, whether that be do I stay or go in a relationship, do I stay or go in a job, or even in a career, like, do I start in my own business? So like we're talking a significant decision. How do you know? To go with your intuition, you know when you say, like this is crazy, I've got to have something to base a decision on. That's like facts, that's hard, that's tangible. What do you do then?

Veronica Drake Guest12:32

So great question. If you're me and you've been doing this for 30 years, you can trust that that hit right and you just follow that. However, most people feel comfortable uniting intuition and intellect. Right. And here's the thing we weren't given intellect, for no reason. We need intellect and we cannot just rely solely on intuition. Now you know, because we need the two to unite, we need them to meet.


So here's how I work it you ask the question or you present the struggle. You can do this internally here, or I'm a big writer, like I like to write it down, like, let me just figure this out in writing. You write it down and then you just sit back. You take a pause and you sit back and you say, okay, what could I do to solve this? And then you let quick hits come in. I call them the quick hits, quick hits, quick hits and you just label it, label it, label it, no judgment. Then, when you're done with the quick hits and this is very quick, because the longer you lament, the longer you think you're allowing intuition to come in or intellect to come in Now we are going to unite intellect, but first we have to get those quick hits out.


Now we're going to go back Once we got no more quick hits and we're going to look at it. We're going to say, intellectually, does this make sense? And then we'll say, well, it does make sense, but it shouldn't happen until here. And this doesn't make any intellectual sense at all. Or, oh, I never thought of that. And here's how it can intellectualize in my life.


It's a process, right, making monumental big life decisions like do I stay married, do I leave my job? Right, you can't just fly by the seat of your pants. You just can't, like it's, you know well, you can if you want to, but you're going to face cause and effect. Making decisions happen with intellect and intuition united. And so the only way to get this out is to say here's the question what would my intuition tell me? And then you're going to get what your intuition will tell you. People are going to say is that my intuition or is it my thoughts? Again, expansion, contraction. But let's just, for the sake of our argument, assume that you've asked what would my intuition tell me and you're going to allow it to be your intuition, you're going to give it permission. You're going to say, okay, I'm going to trust that this is my intuition, I'm going to go out on a limb here and trust it.

Karen Covy Host15:21

Write it down list it out.

Veronica Drake Guest15:23

And then, okay, intellect, what do you say about these steps? What do you say about these solutions? To even get more finite, with it you could write down what you want to have happen. Say an outcome I would like to be in a new job by 2025. Let's say that's the outcome. What are the steps I need to do to make that happen? And then again, quick hit, quick hit, quick hit, intuitive. First, you do this, then you do this one, two, three, four, five and you've got five hits. Now you come back and you say all right, intellect, what do you think about these five hits? And the intellect goes well, five needs to be one. And then you need to do three instead of four, that needs to be two. And you intellectualize the steps. You've got the steps intuitively because you didn't use the rationale right.

Karen Covy Host16:24

Go ahead. Okay, let's say you're saying that you're facing this big decision, whatever it is. You ask okay, intuition, what should I do? What are the steps? And you got a lot of nothing. Okay, now, what You're like? Well, I guess I don't have intuition.

Veronica Drake Guest16:40

You'll always get something. So here's what you do when you're stuck. I call it a brain dump. Okay, so intuition, I want to be in this job by 2025. And all of a sudden, you've got your trusty pen and your paper. Or you're just thinking in your head and you hear did I put the clothes in the dryer? I need milk. What's for dinner tonight? I'm hungry. Jeez, my back hurts, right, is that?

Karen Covy Host17:12

I think you've been listening into my head. I mean, you're all over the place.

Veronica Drake Guest17:17

It's like right, the Buddhists call it monkey mind. You have to honor the monkey mind. You have to do the brain dump. In other words, you know you've got to go through the motion of did I put the wash? But don't have attachment to. Do not get up and put the wash in the dryer. You're going to think it. So you've got a brain dump it all. Write it all out. Did I put the wash? I mean literally word for word. Did I put the wash in the dryer? Did I do? Do I need milk? Am I going to go to the store today? What do I need from the store? And then, eventually, what happens? You get through it all and all of a sudden you start to see make a date for coffee with yourself, decide what you really want to do, and you'll start to see a change in the talk up here Because, believe it or not, you will exhaust your brain. You will, it is possible.

Karen Covy Host18:18

Okay, how long does that? I mean? Are we talking months, years, Like how long does this take?

Veronica Drake Guest18:27

It takes as long as you want it to take, because you have free will, so you can choose right out the gate to believe it. So let's try this. So Karen wants to take a vacation, but she doesn't know where she wants to go. Right, okay, the outcome is vacation 2024. Right, what's the first thing that comes up? Let's do it, Karen. Where do you want to vacation? What are all the options?

Karen Covy Host18:53

The options are to go back and see family in Europe. Okay, the options might be to go hiking in the mountains, go to the beach. Beach sounds good.

Veronica Drake Guest19:07

Okay. So there's three options. You came up with them very quickly because you know them, right. There's something attached to your heart about them, right? Yeah? Now we go back and we say okay, Karen, let's intellectualize this. If you could do all three of them, which one's most practical to do first?

Karen Covy Host19:31

Probably Europe, because we really need to go see family there. I mean, my mother-in-law is not getting any younger and so we really that would be a good choice.

Veronica Drake Guest19:44

Okay. So you got to that because, intuitively and this is all very simple, I'm not, we're not going to bring up your life choices on here, but very simple. So now you have going to Europe 2024 as an outcome. Intuitively, Karen, I want you to fire off as quickly as you can, without thinking what are all the things you need to do to get ready to go to Europe in September of 2024? List them out, just dump them.

Karen Covy Host20:13

Get plane tickets  Check with family when we can stay with them when we would need to be other places Okay. Get hotels for the nights that we're in other places. Get the business covered. Make sure that people know I'm going to be out of town this time and that time and not schedule meetings and do all of those things.

Veronica Drake Guest20:37

Okay, so we have plane tickets, we have contact family, get a hotel booked and get the business covered. They're the order that you gave them to me, and so does it make sense to buy tickets before you connect with family?

Karen Covy Host21

Probably not, right.

Veronica Drake Guest20

So the first thing becomes you got all these intuitively. There's nothing wrong with them.

Karen Covy Host21:01

All right, let me stop you right here. I mean, this is just the logical things that I would have to do. How do I know that this wasn't all intellect?

Veronica Drake Guest21:11

It came to you very quickly.   What's it going to take for you to make a s'more? You know intuitively, you need the graham crackers and you need to this and you need to that. Right, it comes up very quickly, right Now, intellectually, what goes first, Karen? Well, the graham cracker. You have to lay the graham cracker down. So we know these things because we're wired to know things. Part of it is we have experience. Maybe you've been to Europe before, and so it lives somewhere in your subconscious mind and it's in there. But it's been wired to you to tap into your subconscious mind. We can go deep, deep, deep into the layers of this, but, for simplicity's sake, there's somewhere in you that just knows that you know.

Karen Covy Host22:14

You know, I think maybe I'm thinking of this differently, because when you say wired, I literally think of, like, the connections, the neurocircuitry in my brain. Too much of a science geek, I guess, but you know. So that's what I'm thinking, but it sounds like you're talking about wiring energetically. Okay, tell me more about that. What does that mean?

Veronica Drake Guest22:36

so, in the spiritual, metaphysical realm, energy? Well, in the science thing, it's a realm, it's a thing. Have an EKG, have an MRI, that's your energy. You've ever heard of your aura? Energy. You ever walk in a room and you go oh, you could cut the tension with a knife. Yeah, the air is chilly, right, that's energy, that's what you're putting out. That's what you're putting out, that's what you're feeling. The energy that created us. God, bob, allah, whatever you want to call it. That energy, that invisible force, is what we're connected or wired to.  it's a, it's an energy highway okay,

Karen Covy Host23:17

so when you say connection or the wiring, it's the wiring to some, it's the wiring to source, to a different. Okay, so, it's not the internal brain wiring.

Veronica Drake Guest23:46

Once you get the intuitive hit and you understand who you are intuitively and you want to reframe the conditioning, then it becomes neuroplasticity and the brain and the wiring and all of that. But that's a different level of it.

Karen Covy Host23:54

Okay, what happens when you're trying to figure out some major life decision and your intuition and your intellect are at odds. Like, intuitively, you feel you should maybe go leave the marriage or leave the job or what have you. But intellectually you're saying but I have 20 years invested, but the kids, but the money or the career? It's like I've been here so long, what else would I do? So you've got the two that are at odds. Now what do you do to sort through that? So again.

Veronica Drake Guest24:32

If it expands you, that's going to be a healthy choice. Because if you're going to stay in a contracted space, now let's take it back to the energy again. If you're going to stay in a contracted space with no other outside, different solution, you're going to begin to block up and be stagnant and ultimately it comes to dis-ease disease. Okay, that's the whole bottom line. There's a whole study on why people get sick and it has to do with their energy backing up. They're not following through their intuition. Cancer, breast cancer especially is very prevalent in women. Caregivers who over give it backs up. Oh yeah, the world of energy is fascinating. Oh yeah, the world of energy is fascinating. So, bottom line, staying in a marriage or staying in a job that makes you heavy or lethargic or stuck is ultimately going to make you stuck everywhere.

Karen Covy Host25:34

But what if, intellectually, you say, yeah, but I got to pay the bills? I mean, yes, I know this isn't great, but maybe I can make it work? If you're talking marriage, I made yes, I know this isn't great, but maybe I can make it work. If you're talking marriage, I made a vow, I made a promise. I've got kids. It's going to hurt them. How do I? Yes, intuitively maybe I feel a little bit closed on, but practically speaking, I've got to pay the bills, I've got to eat tomorrow. How do you resolve that conflict when people are so stuck? They might say, yeah, intuition is great, but that and five bucks buys you a cup of coffee at Starbucks.

Veronica Drake Guest26:13

So you would not make an impromptu decision on your marriage in a minute. That would be silly. But you are going to get the hit and remember I told you at the beginning, most people won't act on the hit because it requires change. So if you get the hit, that you know this marriage isn't good. But over here is all this stuff that you've been told you need and now you have proof. You need it because you're living in it. So now you have got to sit down and do this exercise that we just did.


So the outcome is I want to leave the marriage Intuitively. What do I need to do to make this happen in two years? What do I need to do to make this happen in six months? And you list down the intuitive part of it I have to talk to a lawyer. I have to find a place to live. I have to look at my debt. I have to consolidate. Whatever your steps are, intuitively, vomit them out and then go back and use your intellect. Okay, listen the things you have to do, and then you make a point to do them. And you can keep using this process over and over, because now the outcome is I've got to talk to my partner. Here's the outcome. What are the things I need to talk about? Intuit, who gets the kids why I'm not happy and then it goes. Then take your intellect and re-talk to them again and label them. I promise this practice. Once you get in the hang of it, it becomes second nature.

Karen Covy Host27:58

How do you learn to trust it. I mean, forget about getting the hang of it, but learning to trust what your intuition is telling you. When, intellectually, you may say I don't know if this is right, or society, they, the ubiquitous. They say I shouldn't do this or it would be stupid or doesn't make financial sense or whatever. Yet something inside of me is saying go for it.

Veronica Drake Guest28:30

Well, do you remember when you were a little girl and you learned to ride your bike?

Karen Covy Host27

Oh, yeah, and that was painful.

Veronica Drake Guest28

Yeah, it is painful. Trust is painful. Sometimes it hurts until you can get fully involved in it, right? You never know when they're going to let go of the back of the bike. You never know when it's you doing it or somebody's holding you up. You don't know that until you're way down the road. So sometimes, having faith and just saying okay, I'm choosing to trust in this guidance rather than relive the loop of the things that are not working. And that's where the fear comes in, because trust is a very sticky place to be.

Karen Covy Host29:21

Trust is a sticky place and I know so many of my clients. They're stuck in the fear, in the what if? Land right, what if this, what if that? And when you say what if? It's interesting because most people you don't hear people say what if everything turns out perfectly and I'm really happy? Like that isn't part of what if land, what if? Is always the bad stuff right? That isn't part of what if land, what if? Is always the bad stuff right? What if you know I don't get another job and I end up, you know, living on food stamps? What if you know this? You know I leave the marriage and then I have regrets and I wish I hadn't done that. What if? What if, what if? How do you get people to move beyond the fear and into that trust? Because it's easy to say is not so easy to do.

Veronica Drake Guest30:09

And this is where my coaching comes in, because we take the what if and we go into it. What if you get on food stamps? That would suck. Well, okay, so logically, all right, that's the emotion that would suck. What, okay, so logically, all right, that's the emotion that would suck. What if? But what if? Because? Because what's the reality? What if you get on food stamps?


Nobody wants to get on food stamps, but if that's your choice, if that's where you're at to gain your freedom or to get your expansion, you've got to keep your eye on the big picture. I use use this analogy. This is very helpful. When I was a little girl, there used to be a creek or a creek, however you want to say it and we would go there and my grandmother would watch us and she'd say you can go to the other side, but you can't get wet.


Okay, how am I going to do that? You can take your shoes off, but don't get your shorts wet. So what you have to do, and when you're making decisions, but don't get your shorts wet, so what you have to do, and when you're making decisions, you've got to find that first stable part, that first stable piece that you're going to land on. You have to look for one rock that was firmly in the creek right, and then you put one foot on it and you test it, and then you put the other foot up. That's how you build trust. You make one decision, you get on that rock, you stand in that decision and then you go. Only from that place can you look for the next solid stable place to land,

Karen Covy Host31:34

okay, but what if you put your foot on that and it all looks good? You put your other foot on it. There go your shorts. They're all wet and your grandma's mad on and there go your shorts.  They're all wet and your grandma's mad.

Veronica Drake Guest31:47

So how would that happen if it were in distance, where I could shake it, take it? You can always slip right. That's a possibility. That's the what if. But what if? I've done my homework, I've, I've wiggled this rock with my foot, I've done everything I can do, that I can see and I get on that rock. And what if there's moss on there or algae that I didn't see and my foot slips off? What if? So now I'm in the water, I'm wet.


What's my next decision? Am I going to cry? Am I going to be afraid? Am I going to be scared because grandma's going to yell at me and I got my shorts wet and I got wet in my pants? Now, or am I going to stand up? Am I going to say you know what? That sucked, I don't like a wet ass. But you know what? Here we go and I get up and I go all right, put your big girl panties on. Where do I step next? This is all. Listen. Nobody said this is easy. It's simple, but it ain't easy.

Karen Covy Host32:55

Yeah, no, I agree with you a hundred percent. And there's a concept in the science of decision making I don't know if this is a technical term, but it sounds like it's something called ooching, and it sounds like what you just described that you take you take a small step first and you test the waters and it either works or it doesn't. But if it doesn't, the consequence of having made that wrong mini decision is not like life earth shattering, right, you can always go back and regroup and start again, and it sounds like this. I mean, other than having grandma yell at you, that kind of sounds like the same concept.

Veronica Drake Guest33:35

Yeah, and and listen. Life, your life, my life, life is nothing more than a series of decisions.

Karen Covy Host33:46

Oh, I like this. Tell me more

Veronica Drake Guest33:47

if you want to look at your life and say I'm here and I've got here because I decided to do this and then I decided to do that, and then I decided to do this. It somehow brings all the power back to you. You are in a marriage that hurts, that's sticky, that's contracting because of decisions you made. And listen, I'm not saying right, wrong, good, bad, and there are people that will take this as a slap in the face and that is not meant to be a slap in the face. You made the decisions you made because of where you are, that's all. There's no right or wrong or good. But you want to get out of it. You've got to make a different decision. What did Einstein say? The insanity, the definition for insanity, is making the same decision with the mind that created it.

Karen Covy Host34:40

Yeah, it's doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.

Veronica Drake Guest34:44

Yeah, and you can't. Yeah, I can combine two of them. You can't solve a problem with the same mind that created it.

Karen Covy Host34:51

Yeah you can't solve a problem with the same level of thinking that created the problem, so you have to learn to think differently, ie you got to change, think differently. Ie you got to change.

Veronica Drake Guest35:06

And really and again, this all goes back to intuition, because your intuition is it's telling you. It's telling you it will never lead you the wrong way. This takes practice. This takes practice.

Karen Covy Host35:18

Okay, I got to ask you you've worked with I don't know hundreds thousands of women at this point, right Plus yourself. Have you ever seen intuition lead someone astray? I mean, has that happened where somebody said I went with my intuition and now I'm F'd because this didn't work or that didn't work or the other thing?

Veronica Drake Guest35:41

So let me give you a very personal example of that. Okay, in 2006, I had a very good job, but I was miserable. I had all the worldly great money, great benefits, seniority, senior leadership everything you could want. I was trained. This is what you want. I met a life coach, I started working with a life coach and, all of a sudden, I started, I got, I just like this is something's wrong. Something's wrong. I don't. I was about 45. Something's wrong, something's wrong. I can't. You know, I can't do this or I'm going to be. I was younger and, um, I went, I can't be in this job anymore. And I kept feeling that. And when I at when I said leaving this job, I got expansive. I didn't know anything more than that. Okay, I jumped off the cliff, so to speak. I quit my job.

Karen Covy Host36:36

With nothing else?

Veronica Drake Guest36:44

With nothing else. I was newly divorced, I had just purchased a house, right, but I honored the nudge. I hadn't. When I tell you I had no plan. I don't I don't recommend this, by the way, disclaimer but I jumped and here's me I'm going down, I'm going down, I'm going down. And I went. Okay, you gave your resignation. Now what? Okay, and I did.


This process wasn't as refined as it is, but I did this. What are my options? I love people. I started to do a self-assessment of, over all the years, what do I do? Well, I could go to this place and I could get hired somewhere. I had tons of experience, right. I did not want to work for anybody else. I wanted my own business. So I listed everything out and I asked myself a very important question Are you willing to be uncomfortable to get this? Had the answer been no, I wouldn't be sitting here having this conversation with you. I was willing to be uncomfortable because, the bottom line is, the only thing that job brought to me was a false sense of comfort. But the reality is, soon after I quit that job, several years after, they eliminated my position. So, one way or another, you were going to be out. You cannot predict whether you're going to slip on the rock or not, but you can make a decision to step on the rock.

Karen Covy Host38:18

You know, that is a really beautiful point and something I think when we're faced with making a decision. Most people don't think of that. They think that if I make the change, I could make a mistake. But we as humans tend to discount if you stay in the same place, you can make a mistake.

Veronica Drake Guest38:41

Absolutely, and we just don't know. You know, as a professional intuitive for 18 years, I've done thousands of readings over the years and I do not have a crystal ball. I don't howl at the moon, I can't give you the lottery numbers and I can't predict. What I can do is read your energy. I can get a sense of who you are, what your passions are and how we can orchestrate that in a way that sets you up for success. So in a sense it's me helping you see the future through a lens that isn't clouded or muddied with your limiting beliefs, because I'm not you, but I can see for you. It's just this I can't believe I get to do this work. It's incredible

Karen Covy Host39:23

that is so fascinating and I don't know if you can see behind me. I can't believe I get to do this work. It's incredible, that is so fascinating, and I don't know if you can see behind me. I have the crystal ball because people expect me. I mean, that's why everybody wants the crystal ball, right, we want to know that if we make a decision, in whichever direction, we're going to be okay. And so finally, I just said I'll get the crystal ball. Don't know how to use it, haven't ever been able to see anything, but at least I have it Right.

Veronica Drake Guest39:49

Even if you have the crystal ball, you know it's sometimes it's really about taking a risk and again being uncomfortable.

Karen Covy Host39:59

Yeah, I can't remember who it was I think it was Dan Sullivan that said something like your success in life is directly proportional to the amount of discomfort you're willing to put up with and the amount of truth about yourself that you're willing to look at, because that's another part of it too. So how does all of this tie into the? What is it? The intuitive incubator? Intuition incubator how does that work?

Veronica Drake Guest40:28

Yep. So I created the intuitive incubator. Think about what an incubator does it grows, it provides warmth and safety and security. Right. And this is for midlife women and I'm looking for business owners. Because she is ready to take the next level, ready to go. She's in transition and she's in this intuitive incubator that's safe and she's learning to trust and develop and use her intuition. And so I'm teaching. And then it's the non-networking networking, because it's not going to be traditional. Hi, I'm Veronica, I do this and here's my 30 second spiel. I detest that. Tell you how much I detest that. I want real life connection. Hi, I'm Veronica. You know what? My toilet was clogged this morning. I spilled coffee on my blouse. I'm an intuitive and I love true crime shows and I worked on a real-life murder mystery. I want the shock value of who you are as a human to be part of your business. That's what makes you different.

Karen Covy Host41:43

I love that. I love that. So, veronica, this has been an amazing conversation. I could go on, and perhaps there will be a part two at some point in the future, but for right now, I just want to thank you for sharing all of your wisdom and intuition. If people want to learn more about you, where can they find you?

Veronica Drake Guest42:04

I am Google-able Veronica Drake, but my website is veronicadrake.com. All my social media is Veronica Drake and I would suggest, if you're a businesswoman, check out the incubator. It's a free service. We meet the first Tuesday, the second Tuesday of every month and if you're looking for guidance, I'm not going to hold your hand, I'm not going to predict your future, but book an intuitive session with me. Let me do a reading for you.

Karen Covy Host42:32

That sounds wonderful and I know I am tempted to take you up on that, and I hope everybody else that's listening is too. So thank you so much. And for those of you out there who are listening, who are watching, please, if you like what you see, if you like what you hear, it will do me a big favor, more good than you can ever know, If you give this a thumbs up like subscribe, and I look forward to seeing you again next time. Thank you.

Head shot of Karen Covy in an Orange jacket smiling at the camera with her hand on her chin.

Karen Covy is a Divorce Coach, Lawyer, Mediator, Author, and Speaker. She coaches high net worth professionals and successful business owners to make hard decisions about their marriage with confidence, and to navigate divorce with dignity.  She speaks and writes about decision-making, divorce, and living life on your terms. To connect with Karen and discover how she can help you, CLICK HERE.


decision-making, intuition, off the fence podcast

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